Are the Tories finished before they start?

James H · Wed 16 Sep, 2009 12.48

barcode wrote:I have to agree, its like everyone has to go to college, actully im starting to think Bog stranded comp, where a bit better, Not everyone uses there head to for works, many other use there hands.,

Now, I'm good, but I'm not that good. What on earth does that mean?

Gavin Scott · Wed 16 Sep, 2009 12.55

James H wrote:
barcode wrote:I have to agree, its like everyone has to go to college, actully im starting to think Bog stranded comp, where a bit better, Not everyone uses there head to for works, many other use there hands.,
Now, I'm good, but I'm not that good. What on earth does that mean?

"I agree, its as if everyone feels the need to go to college. Actually, I'm starting to think a bog standard comprehensive education is better by comparison. Not everyone works in the professional sector - many perform manual labour tasks."

James H · Wed 16 Sep, 2009 13.05

I just don't understand what the context is, or what the point is that's being made...

barcode · Wed 16 Sep, 2009 13.08

you don;t need to Go to college to to learn many of the skills needed to work in manual labour,

there could teach all of skills in high school along with the main 3 English, maths, basic science

Gavin Scott · Wed 16 Sep, 2009 13.17

barcode wrote:you don;t need to Go to college to to learn many of the skills needed to work in manual labour,

there could teach all of skills in high school along with the main 3 English, maths, basic science

No, but you're limiting both your maximum potential income and your prospects within that work environment.

I worked for a company with in-house manufacturing, so there was a significant proportion of the workforce who were only skilled in manual labour tasks. When it came to being promoted to line manager or department manager, they didn't stand a chance.

Taking a skilled trade, such as mechanic or builder or spark or plumber requires years of training on the job - that's not something you can get taught in school, and there's further education colleges who specialise in those skills.

To be *completely* unskilled - like a factory worker - your income will be minimal and your prospects will be reduced. That may seem ok when you're in your early 20s and have no financial dependants, but it would be a different story when you have two or three kids to support.

James H · Wed 16 Sep, 2009 13.33

barcode wrote:you don;t need to Go to college to to learn many of the skills needed to work in manual labour,

there could teach all of skills in high school along with the main 3 English, maths, basic science

At the expense of other subjects? The good thing about keeping that sort of training separate is it offers a choice. I don't want to go into the manual labour trade, but if I wanted to, I could have, by going to a college and learning that particular trade.

Gavin Scott · Wed 16 Sep, 2009 13.51

James H wrote:At the expense of other subjects?

No its definitely a non-starter of an idea. It takes 5 minutes of being shown what to do if you work on an assembly line for vacuum cleaners, but 5 years to be a joiner or plasterer.

Mind you, I wish I had learned a skill like plastering. The pay is great and there's always a shortage of skilled craftsmen. Nice little string to one's bow.

barcode · Wed 16 Sep, 2009 14.09

Gavin Scott wrote:
James H wrote:At the expense of other subjects?
No its definitely a non-starter of an idea. It takes 5 minutes of being shown what to do if you work on an assembly line for vacuum cleaners, but 5 years to be a joiner or plasterer.

Mind you, I wish I had learned a skill like plastering. The pay is great and there's always a shortage of skilled craftsmen. Nice little string to one's bow.

That where I was trying to come from. I thourgh there did teach alot of this stuff in the old Comp High schools,
I put my hands up for getting that wrong!

Gavin Scott · Wed 16 Sep, 2009 14.11

barcode wrote:
Gavin Scott wrote:
James H wrote:At the expense of other subjects?
No its definitely a non-starter of an idea. It takes 5 minutes of being shown what to do if you work on an assembly line for vacuum cleaners, but 5 years to be a joiner or plasterer.

Mind you, I wish I had learned a skill like plastering. The pay is great and there's always a shortage of skilled craftsmen. Nice little string to one's bow.

That where I was trying to come from. I thourgh there did teach alot of this stuff in the old Comp High schools,
I put my hands up for getting that wrong!

Basic woodworking and metalwork in schools (as I recall), but nothing beyond that.

PS: We didn't have the "comprehensive system" in Scottish schools. That was an English thing. We just had "high schools".

barcode · Wed 16 Sep, 2009 14.16

Gavin Scott wrote:
barcode wrote:
Gavin Scott wrote:No its definitely a non-starter of an idea. It takes 5 minutes of being shown what to do if you work on an assembly line for vacuum cleaners, but 5 years to be a joiner or plasterer.

Mind you, I wish I had learned a skill like plastering. The pay is great and there's always a shortage of skilled craftsmen. Nice little string to one's bow.
That where I was trying to come from. I thourgh there did teach alot of this stuff in the old Comp High schools,
I put my hands up for getting that wrong!
Basic woodworking and metalwork in schools (as I recall), but nothing beyond that.

PS: We didn't have the "comprehensive system" in Scottish schools. That was an English thing. We just had "high schools".

I wonder what put that into my head we did have such school. thanks for the tips

tvmercia · Thu 17 Sep, 2009 12.37

Gavin Scott wrote:Mind you, I wish I had learned a skill like plastering. The pay is great and there's always a shortage of skilled craftsmen. Nice little string to one's bow.

oh i can't see you fitting into that sort of vocation gavin. you'd have to have a radio blasting out radio 5 or talk sport, display a builders bum and can you imagine what that plaster must do to their hands.