Metropol

You make a compelling argument. I haven't used Firebird since the early beta - it wasn't too bad. I shall download it as soon as my other downloads have finished.

Edit: I wish the Mozilla site wouldn't use PNG files. They are not as efficient as GIF files on low colour images.

I will also say that I have noticed that the clientside caching implemented by Mozilla and Firebird not as efficent or fast as IE. It also seems to compare files on the network unnecessarily.

Lord Wellington wrote:You make a compelling argument. I haven't used Firebird since the early beta - it wasn't too bad. I shall download it as soon as my other downloads have finished.

Edit: I wish the Mozilla site wouldn't use PNG files. They are not as efficient as GIF files on low colour images.

I will also say that I have noticed that the clientside caching implemented by Mozilla and Firebird not as efficent or fast as IE. It also seems to compare files on the network unnecessarily.

I think it takes more notice of what the server tells it than IE does. There was a cache problem in Firebird - I can't remember if it is in 0.6.1 (the current milestone build on the site) but it's been fixed since.

PNGs are considerable more efficent on 8bit images than GIFs from what I've found and what all the sites say. I think Mozilla's website is just generally slow - I know bugzilla is on a nice fast server now - hopefully the rest of the site will move aswell.

Somebody should have mentioned some other alternative browsers, so I shall leap to the task.

1) epiphany
2) galeon
3) konqueror
4) lynx
5) w3m

Corin wrote: 1) epiphany
2) galeon
3) konqueror
4) lynx
5) w3m

Browsers 1, 2 and 3 work on Linux/UNIX only, but not on Windows. 4 and 5 are just text based web browsers.

As Hymagumba said earlier, Netscape 7.1 and the Mozilla App-Suite 1.4 are almost exactly the same, except for the few extra AOL
bits + bats that come with Netscape. Essentially, the only related AOL related stuff you get with NS7.1 is the combined AOL/ICQ
instant messenger client, and that it mithers you to sign up for a free Netscape/AOL Screen Name and Netscape Webmail on first
run. Having said that, Netscape 7.1 comes with all of the Flash and Java plugins as standard, whereas Mozilla does not. If you
choose to get either the Mozilla App-Suite, or Mozilla Firebird you'll need to download/install all the relevant plugins seperately.
As Mozilla Firebird is still technically incomplete beta software, and v1.4 of the Mozilla App-Suite is mature, complete and very
stable. If you don't mind downloading the plugins seperately, you should choose the Mozilla App-Suite. If you want to have
all the standard Flash and Java plugins installed with the browser, then you should choose Netscape.

BLATANT PLUG ALERT!
There's a really rather excellent, dedicated Netscape and Mozilla forum at the SillyDog701 Message Centre, upon which I've posted
just over 1170 messages, since it officially opened, just over a year ago! Although that could well be because . . . I'm a member
of the SillyDog701 Message Centre Moderation Team! Go to - http://sillydog.org/forum/ . . . registration required . . .

Cheese Head wrote: . . . unfortunatly "IERadicator" doesn't like XP. So, how can I get rid of it?

Chris wrote: . . . IE is tightly intergrated with Windows XP, so it is extremely difficult (if not impossible) to remove. Personally, it's
best just to leave it alone if you don't want to use it - rather than attempt to remove it and fudge up your system . . .

The makers of IERadicator and 98Lite, will be releasing XP/2000 Lite very soon. This will do for Windows XP and Windows 2000,
precisely what 98Lite did for Windows 98/98SE and Windows Malignant Edition, by making the mandatory extras such as MSIE
and WMP into fully optional components. I'm pretty sure they'll also release a new and updated version of IERadicator that
should work on all working installations of Windows XP and Windows 2000.

In the meantime, you can safely disable MSIE from within your copy of Windows XP or 2000 by creating a simple batch file.
To do this, carefully follow the instructions, in this thread on the SD701 Message Centre's "Microsoft Windows" subforum.

If your not comfortable with doing that, you can block IE from accessing the internet via settings in your firewall software.

Corin wrote:Somebody should have mentioned some other alternative browsers, so I shall leap to the task.

1) epiphany
2) galeon
3) konqueror
4) lynx
5) w3m

Do I spot a fellow GNU/Linux user in our midst? (Or do you use a BSD? Or even commercial *NIX?)

My opinion (and mine only) regarding these browsers:

1. Hmm... haven't tried it yet - have been meaning to. Thanks for reminding me!
2. Galeon is nice. I like Galeon. Galeon is fast and uses Gecko.
3. Konqueror is... well, I like the speed, but the rendering engine ain't perfect.
4. Lynx is OK - it does the job. Some pages can be confusing if they use a lot of nested tables etc. (as Lynx ignores table tags!)
5. I like W3M as a text-mode browser. It does what I want. In fact, I was browsing TV Forum and Metropol whilst I was installing a Linux distribution on one of my PCs... just switch to the spare console, make sure the network is up and go! I find the text entry system to be quite strange though (I'm ashamed to admit it, but I've become used to point and click!!!).

4 and 5 don't support JavaScript though, so this affects the login box on Metropol's front page. Can the person in charge change the JavaScript login button to <input type="image"> or whatever it is? I think this should work.

Hymagumba wrote:(love the line in the tiny writing Mark)

Thank you Mr Gumba! I sincerely hope that I am making a worthwhile contribution to this forum...

Lord Wellington wrote:.Edit: I wish the Mozilla site wouldn't use PNG files. They are not as efficient as GIF files on low colour images.

The Mozilla site upholds the GNU charter does it not?

PNG is a GNU copyrighted format.

GIF is a patented commercial format and beware that one day Unisys and a team of lawyers may come after you.

I too, am I Linux user, albeit part time. If I'm not using Linux, I'm using either Windows XP or Mac OS X.
Both my PC's have Linux installed, with SuSE 8.2 on the main one and RedHat 9 on my "testbed" one.
Before any starts to think that I've gone and found a way of running Mac OS X on a PC, I haven't.
(FYI . . . I've got three computers. A couple of Pentium II based PC's and one G3 based iMac)

As for the browsers I use on Linux, in no particular order, there's the Mozilla App-Suite 1.4, plus it's end-
user sibling, Netscape 7.1. Other browsers I have on Linux include MozFirebird 0.6.1 and Galeon 1.2.x.
I would use an updated version of Galeon, but it's almost impossible to install a new version. There are
too many depency errors that pop up, even one saying that it can't find any new versions of Mozilla,
when I've already installed the latest stable milestone of the app-suite, that being version 1.4 . . .

Occasionally used browsers on my Linux OSes are Konqueror 3.1.x and . . . Internet Explorer 6.0 . . . !







































Yes, you read that right . . . Internet Explorer 6.0 . . . on Linux!To all intents and purposes Linux is the
only PC operating system that I'll willingly run IE on, as Linux is effectively neutral to all IE security holes.

DJGM wrote:Yes, you read that right . . . Internet Explorer 6.0 . . . on Linux!To all intents and purposes Linux is the
only PC operating system that I'll willingly run IE on, as Linux is effectively neutral to all IE security holes.

but surely the dreadful page rendering is still there?

If you're running IE in WINE, you'd probably have to use the m$ dll's instead of the wine replacements. ugh.




(btw, I am a linux user too)

Hymagumba wrote:

DJGM wrote: Yes, you read that right . . . Internet Explorer 6.0 . . . on Linux!To all intents and purposes Linux is the
only PC operating system that I'll willingly run IE on, as Linux is effectively neutral to all IE security holes.

but surely the dreadful page rendering is still there?

Yup, it's just as flakey and crap as it is on Windows!

moo wrote: If you're running IE in WINE, you'd probably have to use
the m$ dll's instead of the wine replacements. ugh.


(btw, I am a linux user too)

I don't actually use WINE on it's own, per se, but the CrossOver Office Plugin 2.0.0 from CodeWeavers.com.
It uses a somewhat more polished version of WINE, with a more user friendly and intuitive user interface for
installing apps that were written to run primarily on Windows 98. Still can't get it to run MS Office though.
It keeps falling over, with a message that says "child process killed abnormally", or words to that effect.