You've just set up a false choice. I'm not saying there was no chance, but while western alliance was informally there during the cold war, the EU took it further at when the end of the cold war could have seen it disintegrate. There are some other (IMHO pretty solid) reasons:ali.james wrote: Are you seriously implying that following WW2, without the EU there would have been any possibility of such a war happening?
1. They do a lot of border dispute arbitration work, keeping it in the family (so to speak)
2. It provides a framework to let poorer countries gain more trade routes without territorial disputes
3. Some vulnerable former soviet republics joined and enjoyed relative prosperity and security from membership. I think bringing eastern european states in was a good move for keeping the peace.
4. Increased military co-operation degrading sovereign capability makes it physically harder to fight wars between EU members, just like NATO countries don't tend to fight each other.
What you just asked was "If you totally change your opinion about something, how can you have the same opinion?". That's a silly question so I'll pose a better one: "If you set aside war, is it cheaper to be in or out of the EU?"Because if you are not, how on earth could you arrive at the conclusion that, on balance, the EU has been 'cheap' ?
That's where my knowledge runs out. That's what annoys me about the "debate" so far - there's just no-one setting out the clear advantages and disadvantages of membership in a sensible measured way. I have a feeling not being in the trading area would be financially quite expensive, and not engaging in some of the binding agreements about aspects like the environment could be expensive in a non-monetary way.
No - they're in deep financial trouble because they were shit at collecting taxes and good at spending money (Greece) or enormous housing bubbles bursting (Spain). There's a valid question as to whether they'd be recovering more easily if they weren't in the Euro, but it's a question of default versus bailout. Either way it wasn't being in the Euro that drove them there.The euro project has driven countries into deep financial trouble