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GhostFromTVF
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Joined: Sat 13 Jun, 2020 18.28
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liam wrote: Wed 02 Jun, 2021 20.34 I have to say - I'm quite concerned about the levels of moderation at the new place. I'm worried that mods will get run down very quickly with the levels of how much they do. The back-and-forth between one member and the admin yesterday on the BBC World News forum was uncomfortable... I think both parties were excessive and it wasn't exactly necessary. I'm grateful for the new place being around, but we all make up a forum, not just the people that pay for it. I hope this feels constructive, I just wanted to share the discomfort.
Rob has announced that he’s toning down the moderation levels, which I think is the right move.
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all new Phil
Posts: 1726
Joined: Sun 13 Feb, 2005 00.04
Location: Next door to Hell

I think it’s a tough balance to strike, but fair play to him for being pretty consistent on political talk. You can’t say it isn’t clear but the same people keep pushing it.
Thought this was a nice forum, clearly not.
Joe
Posts: 10
Joined: Wed 31 Mar, 2021 20.15

Brekkie* really gets on my wick with this stuff. I actually think he's a valuable contributor – I don't agree with all he says and sometimes he's a touch too whiny for my liking, but that's subjective and at least he gets discussion going. But why he has chosen the hill of being allowed to post about politics to die on, I have no idea.

He seems to think it's some divine right to make 'sarcastic' (adjective taken from his previous signature) witty asides (at best) and opaque political commentary. It's nonsense. I actually agree with much of his politics, but I just can't fathom why he thinks a TV presentation forum is the place for it. It slows down the chat; he's never going to persuade anyone of an opposing viewpoint to see things his way, he's just going to piss them off. It pisses me off and makes me see him as a bloody 'remoaner', and I am one!

In the dying days of TV Forum I said something like 'I have always seen posting here as a privilege not a right. If we're asked not to post the political stuff then I won't.' I accept that you might want to argue about the rights and wrongs of that, but going against that request repeatedly feels so arrogant. I also understand the view that going off on tangents is an inevitable, healthy part of conversation. Fine. But there comes a point where you just look a little odd – walking into Rob's house and ignoring his request for you to stop bringing up a subject.

Perhaps the problem would be solved if he posted a little less often. Seriously, who has that much time?

*it's not just him
robschneider
Posts: 324
Joined: Wed 14 Aug, 2013 14.53

Brekkie is one of these people who is so entrenched in his outlook that he believes his side's own spin and hype. For example, the way extreme Europhiles have fudged the figures to suggest 63% voted Remain, by counting people who didn't vote and assuming they would vote that particular way. The pushing for a second referendum, people's vote, confirmatory vote, oh that was just a test we shouldn't act on it, it's all bollocks. You can't just re-run the match until your side gets the result it wants.

He's the typical post-2015 Labour voter. The working class have been abandoned by the party set up to serve them, and are now instead courting middle-class graduates in the London boroughs (see also: Khan re-elected despite an appalling record on knife crime, grooming gangs, sexual assault etc.) - problem is they don't realise why the working class have switched sides; a lot of what you might loosely call "working class" are a) white, b) male and c) Leavers. Today's Labour Party just can't reconcile with that fact.
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rob
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GhostFromTVF wrote: Thu 03 Jun, 2021 09.27 Rob has announced that he’s toning down the moderation levels, which I think is the right move.
I'm toning down MY moderation levels. I will still be online, I'll just be focusing more on keeping the site up and running, and doing things to make it better.

I'll certainly be around to make any decisions that need making, and to help the moderators as much as possible.
robschneider
Posts: 324
Joined: Wed 14 Aug, 2013 14.53

I don't think the moderation does need toning down.
gottago
Posts: 205
Joined: Thu 29 Jan, 2009 19.50

robschneider wrote: Thu 03 Jun, 2021 15.51 Brekkie is one of these people who is so entrenched in his outlook that he believes his side's own spin and hype. For example, the way extreme Europhiles have fudged the figures to suggest 63% voted Remain, by counting people who didn't vote and assuming they would vote that particular way. The pushing for a second referendum, people's vote, confirmatory vote, oh that was just a test we shouldn't act on it, it's all bollocks. You can't just re-run the match until your side gets the result it wants.

He's the typical post-2015 Labour voter. The working class have been abandoned by the party set up to serve them, and are now instead courting middle-class graduates in the London boroughs (see also: Khan re-elected despite an appalling record on knife crime, grooming gangs, sexual assault etc.) - problem is they don't realise why the working class have switched sides; a lot of what you might loosely call "working class" are a) white, b) male and c) Leavers. Today's Labour Party just can't reconcile with that fact.
RE - Khan getting reelected, I'm guessing you didn't read into the London election as Khan was clearly the best of a very bad bunch. While the whole ballot was a genuinely bizarre collection of humans, the Tories fielded truly one of the worst candidates I've ever known to be put forward by a major political party. Someone whose manifesto included things he had no control over and barely any influence over. I could have been persuaded to vote for someone else but the amount of bail-outs given to Sadiq that would include obligatory caveats that Boris would then use to throw him under the bus about during the Covid press conferences (and they're still doing it, see yesterday's TfL bail-out that includes an obligatory driverless tube enquiry - despite it already being provably impossible to implement. A total waste of tax payer's money). It was shameful, bullying behaviour and there was no chance I was going to vote for anyone else.

It's all well and good saying that Labour has abandoned its voters but given how the country has, regrettably, veered so heavily to the right they would have lost their heartlands regardless - they're a centre-left party after all and the current climate is not kind to that position. Brexit is unquestionably extremely damaging to Britain and Labour were very much stuck between a rock and hard place when it came to trying to keep its Brexit voting supporters happy whilst also fighting against the Conservatives' reckless pursuit of something that was so obviously not in the country's benefit. It was certainly unfortunate that they were also lead through this period by the worst leader the party's ever had.
all new Phil
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I don’t agree with your assertion that the country has veered heavily to the right.
Thought this was a nice forum, clearly not.
robschneider
Posts: 324
Joined: Wed 14 Aug, 2013 14.53

all new Phil wrote: Thu 03 Jun, 2021 19.14 I don’t agree with your assertion that the country has veered heavily to the right.
The working class have abandoned Labour in significant numbers though.
all new Phil
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robschneider wrote: Thu 03 Jun, 2021 19.36
all new Phil wrote: Thu 03 Jun, 2021 19.14 I don’t agree with your assertion that the country has veered heavily to the right.
The working class have abandoned Labour in significant numbers though.
I’d say it’s more the case that Labour have abandoned the working class. Hence the Tories doing so well in former Labour strongholds.
Thought this was a nice forum, clearly not.
gottago
Posts: 205
Joined: Thu 29 Jan, 2009 19.50

all new Phil wrote: Thu 03 Jun, 2021 19.48
robschneider wrote: Thu 03 Jun, 2021 19.36
all new Phil wrote: Thu 03 Jun, 2021 19.14 I don’t agree with your assertion that the country has veered heavily to the right.
The working class have abandoned Labour in significant numbers though.
I’d say it’s more the case that Labour have abandoned the working class. Hence the Tories doing so well in former Labour strongholds.
But beyond pissing off Brexit voters how have they abandoned the working class? What have they actively done (or not done) to be accused of this? This is a genuine question by the way, I keep seeing this being said but don't really understand what's changed policy wise to be seen as being the case.

IMO I don't think socialism or Labour's traditional values are necessarily as important to the working class as they might have been, particularly given the decline in the influence of unions over the decades. Rather than Labour abandoning the working class it could well be the working class abandoning Labour. The Conservative Party has certainly changed into more of a nationalist party which has clearly appealed to a lot of working class voters, and now many die-hard Labour supporters have broken the seal and voted Tory there's not really any great reason why they wouldn't again if they like these nationalist policies. There does seem to be a trend for nationalism in a lot of European countries at the moment. I don't think we'll see another Labour government for many, many years.

Appreciate this is massively off topic for this thread!
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