The BIG MetroPoll - IN or OUT ?

Are you IN or OUT ?

IN
31
70%
OUT
13
30%
 
Total votes: 44
bilky asko
Posts: 1171
Joined: Sat 08 Nov, 2008 19.48

WillPS wrote:
bilky asko wrote:
james2001 wrote:And now the Lib Dems are saying they're going to campaign on reversing the decision! http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... ign=buffer
Lib Dem diehards I have on Facebook are getting really offended by the suggestion that they're jumping on a bandwagon. Apparently it doesn't count if it's a popular bandwagon...
Jumping on a bandwagon implies a change of views to suit the mood of the moment. On the contrary, this is completely consistent with the party that described itself at the last EP elections as "the party of in". There is no hypocrisy here.

The Lib Dems will do well as a result of this. Unlike the other parties, there is almost no appetite for Leave among their potential voters.
Indeed, I agree that they've clearly been pro-EU for years. I just thought it funny that his only objection to it being deemed as jumping on the bandwagon was that it was popular - the entire point of doing so.

The more I think about it, the more I consider it to be a very shrewd move from the Lib Dems. It'd be very hard for them to do worse than they are now, so capitalising on a strong mood is probably the only move they can make to regain some MPs
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james2001
Posts: 569
Joined: Sat 04 Jun, 2005 23.10

The farce this country's politics has descended into in a matter of days has got to the point I'm not sure I can even laugh any more!
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WillPS
Posts: 2073
Joined: Tue 22 Apr, 2008 18.32
Location: Carlton
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I thought Pete's comments about Corbyn being a cretin were a bit harsh but I'm beginning to feel the same. What the hell does he hope is the best case right now?
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james2001
Posts: 569
Joined: Sat 04 Jun, 2005 23.10

Whatever Corbyn does, there's inevitable a vote of no confidence on its way, and I don't think there's a chance in hell of him winning. He's just looking as pathetic as Bernie Sanders refusing to admit defeat even after Hillary crossed the finishing post.
cwathen
Posts: 1149
Joined: Fri 15 Aug, 2003 17.28

I think pinning remain's failure on Corbyn is a bit much, although the campaign was poor and lacklustre. Even if there was a deeply rooted belief (held by pretty much everyone I should think) that we would never vote to leave, that's not an excuse. I will give the leave campaign credit in that where I live they were at least visible, they were at least posting their tripe through my letter box and were hitting the streets. In contrast all I ever got from remain was the official government leaflet and some exposure to their referendum broadcasts. Focusing on the risks of leaving rather than the benefits of remaining, failure to push people to turn out, failure to get noticed is undoubtedly a factor in the result.

Whether that's right or wrong, Corbyn should admit defeat. The PLP have never liked him and have been itching to mount a coup to remove him from when he was elected. They are going to win this in the end, they'd be better off installing a new leader now and building a campaign to win the inevitable general election which, fixed-term parliament or not, is clearly going to happen somehow by next year.

On the other side, rather than wallowing in the meltdown of Labour, I'm more convinced than ever that Boris & Co are holding crisis talks plotting a way to get out of going through with the brexit whilst somehow claming it isn't an afront to democracy or a u-turn from the position they've campaigned from; this morning Dan Hannan was on Radio 4 acknowledging that almost half the country voted to remain, again stating that there will be no immediate article 50 trigger and stating that they need to 'move forward carefully, gaining consent as they go' on the brexit.

Um Dan, 3 days ago you won a referendum in which a majority of the British people voted to leave - isn't that all the consent your camp need? It doesn't take too much joining of dots to see that there is going to be some sort of additional qualification required before leaving in the hope that they will be able to quash the whole thing.
james2001
Posts: 569
Joined: Sat 04 Jun, 2005 23.10

BoJo admitting it wasn't an "overwhelming victory"- a sign he's already trying to weasel his way out of it.
Alexia
Posts: 2972
Joined: Sat 01 Oct, 2005 17.50

cwathen wrote:Um Dan, 3 days ago you won a referendum in which a majority of the British people voted to leave - isn't that all the consent your camp need? It doesn't take too much joining of dots to see that there is going to be some sort of additional qualification required before leaving in the hope that they will be able to quash the whole thing.
Given that it was an advisory referendum with a majority of under 5%, it's not decisive. For example it even fails the government's own rules for trade union industrial action. Farage said 52-48 would be unfinished business. All it would take is for a pro-EU majority in government and Article 50 would never be invoked.

The government can ignore the will of the British people, easily. It's done so time after time after time. Why should this be any different?
Alexia
Posts: 2972
Joined: Sat 01 Oct, 2005 17.50

DOUBLE POST

Just read Boris Johnson's column.

It's all over. Carry on as normal everyone.....


EDIT : http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/david-c ... 50360.html
Written before the referendum with some startlingly prescient figures.
james2001
Posts: 569
Joined: Sat 04 Jun, 2005 23.10

The Sun aren't encouraging any hatred or trouble at all with this

https://twitter.com/RealMattLucas/statu ... 4881424384

Is it any wonder we've heard so many stories of racist abuse over the weekend when this rag publishes headlines like these?
barcode
Posts: 1473
Joined: Wed 29 Aug, 2007 19.36

Yet in boston, lincolnshire which had the highest out vote, there isnt much and all the local are saying everyone here can stay there just can't deal with anymore.
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WillPS
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Joined: Tue 22 Apr, 2008 18.32
Location: Carlton
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This situation is just fucking stupid now. So Corbyn stays, and gets enough hard lefters to vote for him. Then what? 80% of the parliamentary party have no confidence in him. Are they expecting them just to fall back in line?

Worked perfectly for John Major.
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